learning to heel and toe...any ideas???

[85Celica]

i m learning to heel n toe...and do i need tha brake n tha gas to b tha same height???? do u have to have racing pedals????...help me plz

[GRiDRaceTech]

I have an idea. It comes in a little purplish-blue box near the top of your screen. You know what it contains? White letters that spell out "search."

[Parry]

http://drifting.com/forums/showthrea...light=heel+toe

I even did the legwork for you

[Drift For Food]

Way to help out the little man Parry

It's kind of car dependent as to if it works relatively easily. Some cars are pretty easy and some nearly impossible. Pedal placement is a big factor. Another factor is how flexable your foot is. Some people can twist their feet more than others.

I myself am not the most flexable trying to maneuver my foot sideways, however, I use a method that works for me and my car. Understand that heel-toe isn't exactly limitting you to just using the toe of your foot on the brake and the heel pressing the gas. Any part or combination of parts of your foot works. For example, I use more of the ball of my foot on the brake and then the side of my foot, half way to 2/3 back towards the heel. This works best for my car and works well. If I actually slide my foot down and just use my toes on the brake, getting to the gas pedal becomes increasingly difficult as it requires more twisting. Some others have gotten used to a method that uses nothing other than the flat of your foot. Some just mash both pedals at the same time, the left half of your foot on the brake, the right half on the gas. You may tilt your foot one way or the other to give a little stornger braking or give a little more gas. If the pedals are lined right, they match well enough when pushed down, and your foot is of conciderable size, it may work quite easily. In essence, what works, works. It's not real specific.

When you start out, you'll have a hard time matching everything. Keep it safe and give yourself room for error. You'll have to concentrate on two things, the braking strength primarily and the amount of throttle you add before the downshift. In time, you'll get comfortable varying the amount of braking and throttle to accomodate the situation. It takes time. Don't get upset or give up if you don't first succeed. It might take you a couple months of trying it during your normal driving to get things pretty smooth.

One main note I guess, just for safety, try to give priority to brake control. Even if you hardly add throttle or accidently redline the engine, always try to brake smoothly. I think this is the toughest part as you will gain a tendency to add more braking when you rotate your foot. If you try to focus on the braking aspect every time, this is pretty much elimintated.

Ok one last thing. If you're not used to rev matching to gears. A good way to get used to the rpm changes is to try to tap the throttle and shift down to a lower gear while maintaining the same speed. Don't worry about the braking part or heel-toe. This is simply getting you used to the rpm range you want to be in when shifting down. For example, you're heading down the highway in 5th gear at 65mph. Try to shift down to 4th gear smoothly and then back up to 5th. Just blip the throttle to get the engine reved up to match the lower gear. With a little practice, you should be able to flip up and down gears quite smoothly. It'll get you used to how much throttle you need to add to let you go down a gear or even two smoothly when you start heel-toeing. As well, it can be used as a technique that's very simular to heel-toe. Basically, brake to the speed you want, then let off, blip throttle and change gear. As well, you can blip the throttle, change gear, then brake. This is a step just before you combine the two processes. The results are simular but just not as compact/quick as heel-toe.

Have fun. Expect horrible matching when you first start. The nice thing about heel-toe is that it eventually becomes second nature and becomes what I'd concider a standard manual transmission technique appliable to any car you'll ever drive.

[85Celica]

thanks Drift4food!!

thanks alot for tha help guys...there is one small problem though. my gas pedal is like 2 inches behind my brake n clutch pedal. i know that i have to line them up but i want to do it properly what do u suggest i do????

[Drift For Food]

Ok, quick question:

If you press down the brake pedal, can you touch the gas pedal with any part of your foot?

Basically, you're either going to have to find a way to maneuver your foot to be able to press the gas pedal, or you're going to have to do some modification of the gas pedal(2" extention maybe?) This gets to the area that some cars don't don't work well. The old Ranger I had, first rwd I drifted with, didn't support the heel-toe technique. The gas pedal was like your car, too far down, even when the brake was pressed. I just never did it with that truck. It was grossly underpowered, so I actually benifitied from just dropping down a gear at idle when entering the corner. It would upset the rear enough to start a drift sometimes. It's not all bad. You can still split it up and do the rev matching and brake parts seperately if you just want to do something close to heel-toe. Otherwise, put on your thinking cap and get to work on that gas pedal.

A small note, whatever you do, make sure the car remains safe to operate. This means nothing flimsy, nothing that will move around on you or slide in such a way that could block the brake pedal or get the gas pedal stuck in the down position. Thing simple, safe, secure. Even something like bending the gas pedal arm can weaken it and potentially cause it to break off. Be smart about what you do. That's all.

[craziazzmofo66]

practice.......

[GRiDRaceTech]

Well, you could do the boro thing I did: I used 1500lb epoxy to epoxy a piece of 1/4" thick steel stock onto the brake pedal, and raised the gas pedal ~3/4" by duct-taping a bit of wood to it.

It's ghetto, but better than ponying up like $35 for a pedal set.

[DV_S13SIlvia]

practice.......

I completely agree.. Your always going to suck at something the first time you try it (well usually). Just keep at it, at first I jerked the hell out of my car whenever i tried it. But slowly the jerking subsided, and eventually everything starts to make sense to you. You start to understand things a lot more and notice things with your clutch and gas pedal. I used to hella suck when i drove with my friend, He'd always say "whats up with your car, the ride is all bumpy " But now he doesn't notice at all. Point is, don't give up!

[craziazzmofo66]

I completely agree.. Your always going to suck at something the first time you try it (well usually). Just keep at it, at first I jerked the hell out of my car whenever i tried it. But slowly the jerking subsided, and eventually everything starts to make sense to you. You start to understand things a lot more and notice things with your clutch and gas pedal. I used to hella suck when i drove with my friend, He'd always say "whats up with your car, the ride is all bumpy " But now he doesn't notice at all. Point is, don't give up!

yep s13silvia here did exactly what i did, i just praticed like hell....even when im not in a car i pratice the order in which i would clutch/shift/gas and what not, then when im sitin in a car just wait or something with the car not runnin id do the whole thing just sitin there....then i started doin it lightly when i come up to a stop light and eventually started goin in corners faster and faster with it......

[85Celica]

i just measured the difference of height between tha brake n gas and its a whoppin 2 1/4 inches...i m gonna go with an alumminum spacer on tha gas pedal..tanks guys

[AlexPfeiffer]

if its a 85 celica like your name is. Just grab the pedal and bend it up. The gas pedal itself is on a rod, all you have to do is bend it to where you want it. I also move it closer to the brake pedal to the left.

Another thing to make sure is your getting full throtle. Have one of your friends push the pedal down, then take a look at the throtle body and see if its all the way open, there is a stopper.

[malcolm]

i just measured the difference of height between tha brake n gas and its a whoppin 2 1/4 inches...i m gonna go with an alumminum spacer on tha gas pedal..tanks guys

whoa whoa whoa. before you go around bending and making stuff, ****measure how far they are apart when you are threshold braking.****

It doesn't matter how far they are apart when the brakes aren't being touched. Most cars actually have the pedals reasonably well placed for heel and toe, except for the gap between pedals (laterally). If you have already modified your pedals, make sure that when you are braking hard that the gas pedal isn't above your brake.

[Whisky]

I had the same thought Malcolm did. I would just go out to a nice open piece of road and stomp on the brakes, see if you can roll your foot over to the gas while you are still braking.

As far as heel-toe advice, the thing that really changed my pedal work was actually very simple: lift your heels off the floor. I tend to rest my right heel on the floor when I'm on the gas and my other foot is idle (either on the dead pedal or flat to the floor), it helps keep me from jolting the gas going over bumps and such, but under heavy braking and for heel/toe, pick both your feet off the floor, it will open up a whole new world of pedal control to you.

[85Celica]

i haven't touched anything yet but when i put my foot on tha brake heavy, its about the same distance as tha gas(gas pedal is untouched)...i barely have any room to turn my foot sideways. i got like no room down there. But what if i don't want to brake heavy on tha turn, that would mean i can't reach tha gas without mashing on tha brake....know what i mean!!??!?