new tires gave me understeer!!!

racer555 · 05-18-2005, 06:35 AM

For a while now I have been running Yokohama AVS sports on my car front and rear and my car drifted just fine, broke away smooth and was easy to control. Recently though since money has been tight and I didnt want to pay almost $400 for 2 tires I replaced my rear tires with Yokohama ES100's of the same size. Now to get my back end to come out I have to work way harder than before or I will just understeer. I was under the impression that the AVS Sports were the stickier tire with a softer compound and more tread on the ground. Was I wrong? All I know is now I am probably gonna have to get some matching tires for the front cause I have to get to some crazy fast speeds to initiate drifts now and I miss taking the turns the way I use to. So basically my question was are the ES100's a stickier tire than the AVS Sports?

TIREKILLER · 05-18-2005, 07:06 AM

Why dont you try putting the new ES100s up front and the old tires in the rear? Unless your running stagger that should be fine. I have found that used tires (espescially if they have ever seen the heat of a few drifts) break away much more quickly than new tires.

Just my 2 cents

Aiki-Drift · 05-18-2005, 07:29 AM

Good advice TireKiller. I would def. switch up the ES100 to the front. A lot of people seem to like them up front and complain about their performance as rear tires. GO FOR IT!

j.r. · 05-18-2005, 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by racer555

For a while now I have been running Yokohama AVS sports on my car front and rear and my car drifted just fine, broke away smooth and was easy to control. Recently though since money has been tight and I didnt want to pay almost $400 for 2 tires I replaced my rear tires with Yokohama ES100's of the same size. Now to get my back end to come out I have to work way harder than before or I will just understeer. I was under the impression that the AVS Sports were the stickier tire with a softer compound and more tread on the ground. Was I wrong? All I know is now I am probably gonna have to get some matching tires for the front cause I have to get to some crazy fast speeds to initiate drifts now and I miss taking the turns the way I use to. So basically my question was are the ES100's a stickier tire than the AVS Sports?

If you are understeeering you have more grip in the rear than the front you can lower tire pressure in front and raise in rear a bit. or put stickier tires in front. stickier tires in front compared to rear can create a pivot point at high speeds however for smaller alower courses can you you hold your lines a little better. I reccomend using same all the way around but if not affordable stickier better tires in front.

Falken tires are very affordable btw and they are the best hands down. weve done the taste test and I dont lie!

later,

JR

TIREKILLER · 05-18-2005, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by j.r.

Falken tires are very affordable btw and they are the best hands down. weve done the taste test and I dont lie!

later,

JR

^^^TRUE STORY! I run 205/55/16 Azenis sports on the front of my S13, with whatever tires i can get for free out of the dumpster on the rear. Not the best setup in the world, but it allows me to be out there without spending big bucks.

Uh... on tires atleast.

racer555 · 05-18-2005, 10:18 AM

thanx for the input guys. I am running 235/40R17's up front and 255/40R17's in the rear so unfortunately I cant swap F to R. I completely forgot to check and adjust my tirepressures since I had the tires installed. Gonna check the pressures on my lunch break since I like to run pretty high press in the rear and I bet the tire shop didnt set it where I like it (usually run about 42-45 psi in the rear). Will let ya guys know if it makes a difference after work tonight when I take the car out for some fun.

Delphince · 05-18-2005, 05:53 PM

To answer your question, the Sport does indeed have better traction and cornering stability, but it also torques slightyly less than the ES100. Normally this translates to faster tire response in a steering environment, but on the rear a stiffer tire is more likely to kick out. That, coupled with the assumption that your Sports were broken in while your ES100s are new, is the only explanation I can give you at the moment for why you had less difficulty with your old tires.

soultron · 05-18-2005, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TIREKILLER

^^^TRUE STORY! I run 205/55/16 Azenis sports on the front of my S13

Heck, I got ziex's and they work great too.

racer555 · 05-19-2005, 02:21 PM

tried adjusting tire pressures last night and still no luck. I have to get it completely sideways before I am able to hold a drift (before on the same turn I would only have to start a breaking drift then follow through with power over). I think I am gonna have to buy new front tires as well when I get the money. Then again this could all be fixed very easily when my JIC front coilovers arrive from Japan then I can actually get some decent front camber as well. So until then I guess no drifting for me

soultron · 05-19-2005, 02:44 PM

You could maybe put the new ones in the front since they are the grippy ones. That's what I usually end up doing.

racer555 · 05-20-2005, 06:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by racer555

I am running 235/40R17's up front and 255/40R17's in the rear so unfortunately I cant swap F to R.

But I am working on getting matching front tires and some decent front camber for some more front grip. My Z has always had more understeer than most cars and that needs to be fixed (currently running -.5 deg up front and -3.0 in the rear do to stock suspension design not liking being lowered). With the front camber plates that come with the JIC suspension and the custom rear control arms I am trying to get fabbed up I should get a much more balanced camber setup. It is just gonna take a while.

05-18-2005, 06:35 AM	#1
racer555 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 60	new tires gave me understeer!!! For a while now I have been running Yokohama AVS sports on my car front and rear and my car drifted just fine, broke away smooth and was easy to control. Recently though since money has been tight and I didnt want to pay almost $400 for 2 tires I replaced my rear tires with Yokohama ES100's of the same size. Now to get my back end to come out I have to work way harder than before or I will just understeer. I was under the impression that the AVS Sports were the stickier tire with a softer compound and more tread on the ground. Was I wrong? All I know is now I am probably gonna have to get some matching tires for the front cause I have to get to some crazy fast speeds to initiate drifts now and I miss taking the turns the way I use to. So basically my question was are the ES100's a stickier tire than the AVS Sports?

05-18-2005, 05:53 PM	#7
Delphince Registered User Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Apex, NC Posts: 16	To answer your question, the Sport does indeed have better traction and cornering stability, but it also torques slightyly less than the ES100. Normally this translates to faster tire response in a steering environment, but on the rear a stiffer tire is more likely to kick out. That, coupled with the assumption that your Sports were broken in while your ES100s are new, is the only explanation I can give you at the moment for why you had less difficulty with your old tires. Last edited by Delphince; 05-18-2005 at 06:02 PM.

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05-18-2005, 07:06 AM	#2
TIREKILLER Registered User Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 78	Why dont you try putting the new ES100s up front and the old tires in the rear? Unless your running stagger that should be fine. I have found that used tires (espescially if they have ever seen the heat of a few drifts) break away much more quickly than new tires. Just my 2 cents

05-18-2005, 07:29 AM	#3
Aiki-Drift Registered User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Jersey :( Posts: 132	Good advice TireKiller. I would def. switch up the ES100 to the front. A lot of people seem to like them up front and complain about their performance as rear tires. GO FOR IT!

05-18-2005, 10:18 AM	#6
racer555 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 60	thanx for the input guys. I am running 235/40R17's up front and 255/40R17's in the rear so unfortunately I cant swap F to R. I completely forgot to check and adjust my tirepressures since I had the tires installed. Gonna check the pressures on my lunch break since I like to run pretty high press in the rear and I bet the tire shop didnt set it where I like it (usually run about 42-45 psi in the rear). Will let ya guys know if it makes a difference after work tonight when I take the car out for some fun.

05-19-2005, 02:21 PM	#9
racer555 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 60	tried adjusting tire pressures last night and still no luck. I have to get it completely sideways before I am able to hold a drift (before on the same turn I would only have to start a breaking drift then follow through with power over). I think I am gonna have to buy new front tires as well when I get the money. Then again this could all be fixed very easily when my JIC front coilovers arrive from Japan then I can actually get some decent front camber as well. So until then I guess no drifting for me

05-19-2005, 02:44 PM	#10
soultron Registered User Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: The Willy NC. Posts: 1,059	You could maybe put the new ones in the front since they are the grippy ones. That's what I usually end up doing.