rb20det or sr20det?

[90s13hatch]

Hi everyone..i am planning on swapping my engine on my 1990 240sx...i want opinions on what would be better and sr or rb....i want rb cause sr's are so common...but i love sr's so i want your opinion on what i should do..thanks!

[ZoltecRules]

Step 1. SEARCH

This has been covered WAY too many times before.

PS. Being different tends to = costing more money.

[Ghost of Duluth]

Agreed.

Why in the world would you want to go Sr or RB anyway with good KA-T builders around???? Think about things man, there are so many reasons to go KA-T over either of those engines. Parts availability, ease of change, more torque than an SR, I mean there is no reason other than wanting to be JDM tyte or wanting to waste money that I can see. You can get parts for the KA from Autozone should you break something at an event and any time not spent on the towtruck home is time well spent. You blow that SR and damage the block and it's back to the importer for you buddy. Blow that KA and you can just about kick over a rock and find a block, especially since all the other yahoos are doing SR swaps and leaving thier KA's out to rot.

So throw your money away if you want. SR's and RB's are great engines, not saying anything against em but my money is on the KA-T.

[akuma S14]

KA-t will get you good power on modest budget. I sell the same kit as on the SHOGUN STYLE S14 for 3000 even. 8psi 230-240 hp. twincam only.

Terry

[banged240_drift]

yeah man if you wanna be different do the KA-turbo, or even a well setup all motor, like myself (hey a man can dream) seriously spo many paople are doing jdmtyte swaps that building the KA is going to set you apart from the crowd. just cause you dont see fast KA's in popular magazines doesnt mean thier arent up to par. i mean almost a half liter more displacement added with an iron block, its a monster

to answer your question, ide go with the SR, the RB is gonna be harder to find the motor and the parts

but i gotta say that KA is the way....i just wanted to rhyme

[HoosierDrifter]

i have the sr... and i love it.

1. All aluminum..(KA = iron block)
2. Awsome throttle response
3. can be boosted up to 400hp on stock internals
4. A whole lotta parts are the same as the 92 nissan sentra se-r's engine

[Leroy0053]

throttle response? the ka doesnt have it? plenty of turbo ka's well over 300 on stock internals. plus you say good to 400. are you even close to it? people around here brag how the sr can handle 400. well they have stock sr's and aint even upgrading. so why brag about it handling that much when you dont have plans to go that far. even if you went that far how many people keep the stock internals? forged pistons at least are swapped in. aluminum block. wow. but show me the weight difference in the 2 engines. you list info but nothin to back it. get cha weight up. the guys question was if rb or sr. sr has more parts availability. i would keep the ka personally.

[free motion]

Well, if you want to swap engines I'd say consider either the sr20det or the rb25det rather than the rb20det. Either way you get a great engine, it just takes a little more money and labor to go rb25det (which would be awesome).

[Hollywood]

this guy has a 1990 240sx, probably still has the KA24E motor, that motor is not worth adding a turbo to.

The RB20 is going to be much cheaper then the SR, (last one I sold was for $600) A used KA24DE will probably be a little less then that but have more miles on it. and in my personal experiences the RB20s do not run as well as the SRs

the KA24DE will probably be the most expensive, even if you just go with a stock block and a turbo kit, you will need fuel injectors and some kind of engine management system to make it run correctly.

the SR20DET should probably cost you low $3000 range at most shops, or you could probably do it on your own for a little over $2000. parts are easy to find for these now, the motor has plenty of power, and can easily and inexpensivly be modified to make more.

[HoosierDrifter]

Originally Posted by Leroy0053

throttle response? the ka doesnt have it? plenty of turbo ka's well over 300 on stock internals. plus you say good to 400. are you even close to it? people around here brag how the sr can handle 400. well they have stock sr's and aint even upgrading. so why brag about it handling that much when you dont have plans to go that far. even if you went that far how many people keep the stock internals? forged pistons at least are swapped in. aluminum block. wow. but show me the weight difference in the 2 engines. you list info but nothin to back it. get cha weight up. the guys question was if rb or sr. sr has more parts availability. i would keep the ka personally.

yes i do plan on getting a bigger turbo, yes i plan on getting bigger injectors...does anyone know the weight of the ka or sr?

[Ghost of Duluth]

All depends on where he is as to how much it will cost him. Also remember this, you blow a water pump on an RB, you gonna be down longer than you would with a KA-T. Little things like that can be a major headache on a motor that isn't sold here. As for cheapest you will probably make it out lowest with the RB though if you pay for everything and don't do it yourself.

I still think the KA is going to be the best. You can grab a Tophat crate motor for $3750 complete. That includes the block hot tanked and bored to 90mm, polished crank, shot peened connecting rods, ARP rod bolts, head studs and main studs, 3 angle valve job, Supertech 8.5:1 pistons, Boost design manifold with a t3/t4 turbo and wastegate. $500 to r/r your motor. Put your injectors and stand alone if you want it and you aren't that much more than an SR install and you know exactly what you are getting instead of importing some engine that may start and if it doesn't then you have to fight with the people you got it from. The frustration alone would steer me away from going SR.

But ask everyone a question and everyone will give you a different answer. The SR guys are gonna tell you that all is peachy with the SR and same with every other motor. I just feel that there is no reason to import an engine in when you can get something that can do the same thing or better here. Sounds like a complete waste of money to me.

[Ghost of Duluth]

Originally Posted by HoosierDrifter

yes i do plan on getting a bigger turbo, yes i plan on getting bigger injectors... yes you are a *Censored**Censored**Censored**Censored* face... does anyone know the weight of the ka or sr?

No reason to call names caouse someone called you out. Don't do that again.

[Hollywood]

still sounds like a KA turbo motor is gona cost you way more then an SR20. for the $3750 KA-t sounds like your just getting a refurbished motor, just about every motor you refurbish has to have the cylinders punched out, the head ported a bit, and the crank turned. the only thing really different is the compression ratio, and most engine shops will offer you that option as well.

with the SR20 there are lots of cheap performance parts, cams, intake manifold, larger oil pan(very important for drifting)

but if you are just looking for something to drop in your car, and go drifting, the SR20 is perfect, its inexpensive, its a quick easy swap, no fabricating

[Ghost of Duluth]

Ok i'm going to repeat what I said above because I think you missed it.

"That includes the block hot tanked and bored to 90mm, polished crank, shot peened connecting rods, ARP rod bolts, head studs and main studs, 3 angle valve job, Supertech 8.5:1 pistons, Boost design manifold with a t3/t4 turbo and wastegate. $500 to r/r your motor."

I think you skimmed over what I wrote. But like I said, everyone will tell you different things. I would much rather have a rebuilt engine with a new T3/T4 turbo on it than something that gets yanked in another country, slapped in a container, (hopefully with all the parts there) and sent across the ocean to be off loaded at some dock in god knows where and then crated and sent across the country to land at my doorstep with a start-up warranty that I have to hope will be honored by an importer or garage probably from out of state because we all know that most importers have the "It wasn't installed correctly" clause that they like to fall upon.

But hey that's just me.

[Hollywood]

so what kind of warranty do you get with the KA crate motor? 2 years I would hope.
my point is that any motor rebuild company is going to do all that stuff to a motor anyway. of course they wash the block, and then they bore it out and use bigger pistons. and they have to use aftermarket parts because OEM parts are way to expensive. most motor supply companies do offer ARP studs, and choise of pistons, if you want to change them. city motor supply dose offer a motor just like this for $1100, the only difference is your adding a turbo kit to it.

[Ghost of Duluth]

Exactly correct. So build a KA-T and add up the prices. Some guy above has a turbo kit for $3000 even. So add the turbo kit and your KA build and you get $4100 bucks. The Tophat setup is roughly $175 bucks more installed. That's a done deal, running car, out the door. You know who installed it, who did the work and who to go back to if the install is wrong.

As for Warranty, who in their right mind gives 2 years on a performance motor? You are saying they give a 2 year warranty on an engine once it's turbocharged? Doubt it. But i'm not here to argue with you, simply stating my opinion.

[driftex]

i'd say at least try a turbo'd KA. You could throw one together using SR parts pretty cheaply, and if you like it upgrade, and if you dont swap in an SR.

[Leroy0053]

Hey ghost sorry man didnt mean to stir up any mess. i hate these topics cause there are actually pros and cons on this subject. but lots of times there are opinions thrown out and not facts. but hey good thread none the less.

[Ghost of Duluth]

There really are alot of pro's and con's to any swap and it boils down to what the owner wants. Anyone that is planning a swap should put what they want to in, not what everyone else wants to swap in. They should actually know about the engines they are interested in and that includes researching them, not posting on a forum asking a general question. They should hit the internet running and search just like the #2 post on here stated.

Everyone is right and everyone is wrong depending on who you ask.

[Hollywood]

So if you did the KA24(DE) motor(over bored, ported head), from city motor supply the long block is ($1100) with a 1 year warranty. then you add the cost of the greddy turbo kit ($3000). then an intercooler($800), fuel pump($120). thats over $5000, and with out a propper engine management its going to run like crap.
**dose not include labor**

now compare that to $3500 for an SR20det installed, includes parts and labor.

[Ghost of Duluth]

So for $3500 I could roll into your shop, (I'm guessing you have one or how could you quote all of this, if you don't then one can only guess that you have no clue and are not speaking from experience, I don't know) and roll out with a complete SR install? Is this a Redtop into an S13 or a Blacktop in a 14 or is it any combination of motors and vehicles? So $3500 for everything no matter the year of engine or car, broken pieces, rusty bolts or any of the other unknown factors?

Well lets break it down. For me to just go out and get an SR as a regular person (with no shop, friends that cut deals or my own lift) I would look on Ebay, quickest place to look, Red tops are going for around an average price of let's say $1800 bucks with tranny, ecu, ignitor and harness, now most that I saw are without an intercooler so you need an that, $800 by your guesstimate, Then shipping to get it here, say $200 depending on where it comes from, then the labor to get the engine in the car which runs say $1000 for redtop to s13 chassis with wiring. That's $3800 before anything else such as bad water pump, plugs, some random bracket or thing-a-majig that got broken during the palleting, lost pieces, bent tailshaft coming out of the trans because it was put on the pallet with the tail hanging off and got smashed, seals, dented oil pan, bad injector, forgotten ignitor, bad ignitor, motor sitting outside or whatever else decides to rear it's ugly head during removal, crating, transit, offloading, delivery, mad truck driver, road rage, soccer mom cutting off the delivery truck causing a panic stop and your engine slamming into Miss Johnsons new stainless refridgerator and cracking your valve cover and etc etc. So you can expect to drop another $300 to $???? bucks on that stuff not to mention the downtime waiting for all of this.

Then you end up with a motor with 35k to who knows what k mileage on it that you have a start-up warranty from somebody you have never spoken to face to face, no history, nothing. Let's not revisit the multitude of complaints, lost money and no warranties honored that have graced these hallowed pages over the last 2 years. This is worst case scenario of course, someone may luck out and get a deal, get a perfect motor and everything goes in smooth...but anyone that owns a shop or has had an install knows, it rarely works out that way. I would much rather spend more and have something that has zero miles on it, completely fresh ( and with a one year warranty from City Motor Supply ) on it. I know who did it and what was done to the car and who to go to if it's screwed. But once again, that's just me.

And that's just a Redtop, up the price for a Blacktop. But I guess to some people the time and the money means nothing in the great quest to be JDM. Like I said, it's all a personal choice and the owner of the vehicle has to make it. Motor swaps are the final thing that a person should ever have to do to a Drift car anyway, just a waste of money if you haven't learned your car and moved up through suspension mods. But once again, my opinion.

[Hollywood]

I have the clips in stock, all swaps are done using a front clip, that way you do not have to worry about piping and hoses or hardware pieces. thats the best way to go, and its a very quick swap.
I didnt mean for this to turn into an advertisement. but go ahead an email me if you are interested

[Ghost of Duluth]

$3500 sounds like a good deal to me. Nothing wrong with an SR by any stretch and if you don't want to spend the extra money for the KA-T then the SR is the way to go. I just like the KA-T and once again, that's my opinion.

[Leroy0053]

for the guy that originally posted this thread. if you piece together your turbo kit it will be a lot cheaper. the greddy kit is expensive. plus there are other engine management options. like megasquirt and so on. but yeah man go to the sr and ka-t forums and search, dont post, search and you will find good info man.

[krazyroadster]

Ghost your my hero, now I am going to have to buy a top hat crate motor. I never really thought of what you will have to do to a SR when you get it. Good posts you need to post on SEDA more. I HAVE SEEN THE LIGHT!