no mass air flow sensor

if i want to run nothing on my turbo, (no filter or mafs)where would i put it,the mafs.i want to run just a mesh over it.heres a pic,it would kinda look like this.

[raging panda]

you would either have to run a blow through setup ( the maf set up in the intercooler piping somewhere) or run a standalone engine management so you could use a map setup instead of a maf.

so say a power fc would take care of that?

not even close guys.
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MAP conversion. Stand alone engine management.

or buy a Honda

[nissanguy_24]

this may be a dumb queston, but on turbos like that how do they get around a lack of a filter? i mean wouldnt dirt and *Censored**Censored**Censored**Censored* get into the engine same as a NA car with out an air filter?

race only. I wouldn't drive that on the street. One little pebble, and bye bye nice expensive turbo.

[raging panda]

like i said standalone or blow through. Drag racers usually dont run filters on their turbos since its a short run on a relatively short track. I wouldn't suggest the same thing w/ drifting.

[driftxtreem]

you will need to convert it to a map with a standalone the blowthrough will not work. You have to show a value before it enters the turbin. The value of pressurized air will not counculate corectly I doubt you could tune it to Idle.

[raging panda]

I know the blowthrough works for low boost applications, but not sure about higher boost or upgraded engines. Lots of SR guys on other forums have posted about using blow through and although it isn't the best setup it does work. The MAF on SRs don't have problems calculating pressurized air and neither do other nissan MAF that are designed the same. At least that is my limited knowledge on it, driftxtreem might know more than I do about that.

[driftxtreem]

With a MAP sensor you are reading the pressure of the air in the Surgetank/Manifold. You can mesure this presure under full boost and an Idle. With a MAF you are mesuring the air coming into the engine. When the MAF reads the air flow it calculates a value for fuel to be added to the air. The 14:1 ratio is the best on a normal ECU and the ECU will correct itself for this value. If you put the MAF on the boost side of the turbo it is reading a value of boost and will add fuel to keep the 14:1 value. This would cause in many cases a rich run because of the presure. at an Idle the presure is gone and a vacume is present. with the MAF on the boost side of the turbo you are drawing air threw you intake filter then threw your turbo and not showing a value that is efficiant for the 14:1 ratio.

A MAF is not exactly the cleanest way to mesure air, and on a boosted system it is prone to poor fuel economy.
Lets say you have a BOV that is atmospheric and a MAF when you release the throtal the BOV dumps the already caculated pressure from the MAF but the MAF has given a reading for X amount of fuel. The fuel will not be cut and this rich fuel will travel threw the system causing waist and poor economy. most factory boosted engines with BOVs will returne that air back to infront of the MAF for a recount and then the fuel will be recaculated to match the released volume.

The MAP no matter what will always caculate manifold presure to fuel so even with a atmospheric BOV it will still caculate the correct fuel to air ratio based on that volume.

[foilman]

Sorry to go against you driftxtreme, but blowthrough setups work fine. My car is working proof of it, and has been for over a year and a half. The S13 style MAF sensor doesn't seem to like the setup as much, and sometimes the piping design will subject the MAF to turbulent flow = poor readings, but the S14 style mafs and many others work great. Plus, it makes BOV's vented to the atmosphere a non-issue. Granted my car isn't making monster power (260-270 whp), but I know many people running blowthough MAFs and some of those in the 300s or more.

The MAF is not affected by changes in air pressure, that's exactly WHY it's called a mass airflow sensor. It measures the mass of the air, independent of temperature or pressure (within reason).
Your technical explaination for it not working... the pressure messing it up and time issues for when things are measured are the same things nay-sayers said years ago when I proposed doing the setup (not that I was the first ever, but was the first to really urge others to do it in the 240 community [boost was still way in the future for me]). It usualy led to big arguments and to me it sounded like "you can't sail AROUND the world... because it's FLAT". Finally some people with the time and resources braved the waters and now it's pretty common, with dozens of blowthrough 240s in the US, both SR and KA.

[driftxtreem]

Originally posted by foilman
Sorry to go against you driftxtreme, but blowthrough setups work fine. My car is working proof of it, and has been for over a year and a half. The S13 style MAF sensor doesn't seem to like the setup as much, and sometimes the piping design will subject the MAF to turbulent flow = poor readings, but the S14 style mafs and many others work great. Plus, it makes BOV's vented to the atmosphere a non-issue. Granted my car isn't making monster power (260-270 whp), but I know many people running blowthough MAFs and some of those in the 300s or more.

The MAF is not affected by changes in air pressure, that's exactly WHY it's called a mass airflow sensor. It measures the mass of the air, independent of temperature or pressure (within reason).
Your technical explaination for it not working... the pressure messing it up and time issues for when things are measured are the same things nay-sayers said years ago when I proposed doing the setup (not that I was the first ever, but was the first to really urge others to do it in the 240 community [boost was still way in the future for me]). It usualy led to big arguments and to me it sounded like "you can't sail AROUND the world... because it's FLAT". Finally some people with the time and resources braved the waters and now it's pretty common, with dozens of blowthrough 240s in the US, both SR and KA.

thanks foilman for the info Ill have to learn more on this.

fkn rad,i would just run a mesh to drift,then filter
thanks

[raging panda]

Yea, if I end up turboing my KA i'm gonna run a blow through MAF setup so I can use an atmospheric bov.

[sil180sx]

Originally posted by nrgdrft
if i want to run nothing on my turbo, (no filter or mafs)where would i put it,the mafs.i want to run just a mesh over it.heres a pic,it would kinda look like this.

why not move the maf to the throttle body side of the intake... thats what people do over here. pretty sure all you have to do is extend the wires

do u know anyone who has done it?im sure it will run but will it lose airflow?

[sil180sx]

how would it lose airlflow? only difference that i see is that you are measuring compressed air instead of ambient air.... shouldnt make a big difference just might run rich

i still take acid to make things weird?