Is there a too High octane fuel?

[VertigoEpidemic]

On my non-drift days I've started to hit the drag strips. A friend of mine says he can get me some 130 octane fuel to boost my performance. First off (not that it matters)... is it safe on the engine to use something that high? Second... is there anything I need to do to prep the car to use such a high octane. And third... Will it give me much better performace?

It has been running on 93 octane gas with octane booster in it at ever full tank.

I've been told I might have to "remap the ECU" because the octane level is so high... but I'm not sure what exactly he ment about that and I'm not sure that would really do anything.

btw... the fuel is a purple color...

[VertigoEpidemic]

Anyone know how I should go about this? or even do it for that matter.

[Hachi-roku04]

higher octane levels make your engines run a lot safer
spoon and mugen hondas that have over 11.5 comp have to use around 100 octane to keep from detonation. but the highet the octane levels the less pure gas their is so it can rob up to 5 hp but it is great for drag because it will alow motors to run super high comp ratios without blowing up and they dont worry about 5hp when they get 30 hp from the compression

[VertigoEpidemic]

Would remaping the ecu be required... if so how do I do it?

[DRIVER]

Do more reasarch!!!!!!! It's not worth blowing your car up... man you already had problems with ur tranny and know you want to have problems with you engine lol

[Hachi-roku04]

i dont think it matters but u might need more fuel because it should burn faster so if u got a afci-II or sumting you could make a map for the high octane levels

[VertigoEpidemic]

Well I found out that gas with an octane level of 100 is jet fuel. So what is 130 normally used for? Will the 37 extra levels have a really big differance in performance. If so, would it be more of a quicker accel. or higher speed? I can't really tell a difference between 87 and 93 except for the smell of it. As for performance I can't tell a difference. Then again that was back when I had the old '87 Camry.

[MrodDrft]

u get more performance cuz u can changed the tuning, cuz its less resistant to knockage

[Feint]

No!!! Using 130 octane in a street car is a waste.Not only will you begin to actually make performance gains in the negatives,you also run the risk of causing some damage.Ignition timing would also have to be changed anyways...Either way..Why the hell would you even try anything over 114? Also,last time I checked jet fuel was leaded...correct me if I'm wrong? Leaded fuel=fun for your cats...

[VertigoEpidemic]

I'm looking for a higher octane because I've started to drag race lately and im just looking for a quick and easy (less parts added the better) boost other then nitros... and 130 is easier to get a hold of.

[Coiloverkid]

you wouldnt notice a difference unless you're tuning for it. 130 octane is rediculous, the most you'd want is probably 108. anything over that will fry your sensors from the EGT's and melt your cat's.

we run C16 race gas in my shop's WRX, and that's a little much, at about 110 octane. It mainly helps prevent knock, and with a fully progammable ECU in the car we can ramp up the ignition timing with that kind of gas.

For you, however, it wouldn't be worth it.

[Emagdnim]

Higher octane doesn't mean more performance. If your car is not "knocking," using a higher octane fuel will do absolutely nothing for you but waste your money. Octane doesn't rate a fuels explosive ability only its ablity to resist knocking.

Adding lead to your fuel will increse octane. Go add some lead to your fuel and see if it makes you go faster.

[prodigy]

Originally posted by Feint
No!!! Using 130 octane in a street car is a waste.Not only will you begin to actually make performance gains in the negatives,you also run the risk of causing some damage.Ignition timing would also have to be changed anyways...Either way..Why the hell would you even try anything over 114? Also,last time I checked jet fuel was leaded...correct me if I'm wrong? Leaded fuel=fun for your cats...

Exactly, you have no use for it and it isn't going to do you any good. Run premium all the time to make your car more happy.

[RyanHampton]

Basically here is an easy answer...

Higher octane = burns faster
Lower Octane = burns slower

Now do not mistake burn faster = more power

Like many people have said. Higher octane allows you to run higher compression or forced induction. Other than that you are wasting your money.

[bluballz]

first off, the highest UNLEADED gas i have seen is 103 octane. im assuming the 130 octane your talking about is LEADED and you will be using this in a street car with an O2 sensor. using leaded gas will f@*k up your O2 sensor.

secondly, running higher octane will NOT instantly give you more power. higher octane will only allow you to make more power safely. only if you increase cylinder pressures by either boosting more, rasing compression, advanceing timing, etc. then you will need higher octane to prevent detonation.


as stated before octane is the fuels ability resist detonation. not how fast it burns.

[RyanHampton]

Faster burn is how it prevents detonation. When cylinder pressures increase you will get a detonation or a diesel effect with a slow burning or low octane rating fuel. To prevent that you must use a faster burning fuel which in effect lowers the knock rating. Higher octane fuel also requires more heat to combust. Hence why diesel is a low octane rating it has a lower combustion temperature. If you also look at how an N/A rotory works, it is better to run a low octane fuel to increase the burn time on the combustion cycle.

Thanx

[Emagdnim]

heres a good discussion on octane levels

http://www.britishcarforum.com/ubbth...=&fpart=1&vc=1

I think someone ought to sticky this thread or one of the older ones cause this question is gonna come up again.

[jboss]

Google is your freind...Be as dumb as you want and still look smart.

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/question90.htm

Higher octane only means that the fuel is more resistant to premature ignition from compression....

Fast burn, slow burn doesnt matter...The point is how much you can compress it before it explodes.

Diesel does not have an OCTANE rating....it has a CETANE rating which is a totally different thing.

It is difficult to get a gosoline over 108 octane without lead or a lead substitute.

Jet Fuel is KEROSENE-----Not 130 octane gas

[prodigy]

Originally posted by bluballz
first off, the highest UNLEADED gas i have seen is 103 octane. im assuming the 130 octane your talking about is LEADED and you will be using this in a street car with an O2 sensor. using leaded gas will f@*k up your O2 sensor.

secondly, running higher octane will NOT instantly give you more power. higher octane will only allow you to make more power safely. only if you increase cylinder pressures by either boosting more, rasing compression, advanceing timing, etc. then you will need higher octane to prevent detonation.


as stated before octane is the fuels ability resist detonation. not how fast it burns.

What are you talking about? I don't think you can even get leaded gas, key word is think here. I know you can get a lead addative for older cars that you pour in when you refuel. There are there are certain chemicals that you can put into 93 octane pump gas to bump it up to above 120 octane in your own garage.

[RyanHampton]

Lets see guys how many of you have worked in an oil refinery with chemists? I have. there is one small problem how stuff works is something you read off the internet. Yes the rate in which fuel burns is a factor in octane rating. When you use a craker tower in an oil refinery there are different chambers in which the fuel settles. Through the distilling process is how you get different grades of gas/fuel. When the fuel is compressed into the higher levels you attain a higher octane rating. At the bottom of the cracker tower chambers you get diesel oil, the next level is kerosene, then you get the lower octane fuel, then your 92, then your racing and aviation fuel levels. Now these are not complete fuels, they still have to be blended into different things. your aviation fuel has to be blended with chems that are made to run at high altitudes with low air density. That is why it is not a good idea to use it in your car contrary to popular belief. How the physics works is the same. Yes high octane gas burns faster, that does not mean more horsepower. Now did you know that adding lead to fuel increases octane rating? That is why the max unleaded fuel you can have is 110 unleaded. In order to get an octane rating of 130 it has to be leaded period. Also there has to be more things added like HRB which is a heat releasing agent that is blended with acetone. It will also have to have an another agent called nipar-6 which is another agent that is a stabilizer and mixing medium for the gas. Running this fuel in your car would not be a good idea with an O2 sensor cause it will be gone.

Thank you again.

[nissanguy_24]

Crap.. Hampton is a chemist! way to go man lol!

[RyanHampton]

Also to answer your question again. In order to advance your timing, you have to run higher octane right? Therefore the gas must burn faster to prevent knock. So yes higher octane gas does burn faster. Once again it does not increase performance. You will get the same amount of BTU out of low octane fuel. Now you can add all kinds of additives to increase performance. There are a number of oxygen bearing agents you can add to your gas to increase horsepower. One that I know of is Propylene Oxide which increases the oxygen in the cylinder therefore you can run a litlle richer. I ran this in some of my cars at about a 4% mixture and you will get about a 6% increase in power. In any concentrations higher than that you can blow the motor due to being too lean. It is also safe for O2 sensors. That is what I would use for "cheap" horsepower. Check your rules though in your class to see if oxygen bearing agents are legal. You can also add some "nitro" additives, but I'm not sure how well the medium works cause' nitro methane is not compatible with gas. The other additive is Hydrozene which is in essence rocket fuel. Hard to find, but produces big horsepower haven't seen it in a few years though.

Thanks again..

[TokiEvolution]

Wow... Your smart...

[TokiEvolution]

a kid down my block has a FC a turbo II and he went to a drag strip. i cant remember if it was 110 or 105 octane but he mix the fuel and he ran a 17.5 on the quorter mile.
I think he was pretty imbearist

[Emagdnim]

Originally posted by RyanHampton
In any concentrations higher than that you can blow the motor due to being too lean.

I just want to add why that would happen. Gas acts as a coolant to your combustion chamber before it explodes. So if you run too lean you will overheat. But most modern computer controled cars can adapt timing and fuel air mixture in order to avoid these things to a certin extent.