4age 20v or 4agze? pros and cons?

ONtheROADagain · 11-15-2004, 07:02 PM

hey guys. what are the pros and cons of both the 20 valve (blacktop) 4age, and the 4agze?

Darkstar · 11-16-2004, 08:58 AM

4AGZELU (whichever generation you like)

Pros -
Great "burn-the-tire-for-the-buck" factor (smile), great acceleration from a rolling start (isn't that great from standstill because of the tire slip), TORQUE!!, heavy duty internals - good base for turbocharging after taking the supercharger off.

Cons -
Computer stuff - if the wiring harness vibrates/shakes/whatever the ECU might get a wrong signal from a sensor on the intake manifold, occasionaly causing misfiring and knock, what may result in a Chernobyl style piston melt, supercharger malfunctions sometimes (definetely not as durable as a turbo), quite difficult to swap.

Conclusion -
Great engine if you take some loving care of it.

4AGELU 20 valve (blacktop)

Pros -
Great throttle response (especially in higher revs), VVTi (Variable Valve Timing with intelligence) allowing the engine to produce some nice high rpm horsepower numbers, AWESOME carbie-like sound effects.

Cons -
Even more difficult to swap than 4AGZE, doesn't have this torque, more sensitive for fuel octane changes, expensive and complex to modify.

Conclusion -
A perfect engine for autocrossing and fast road racing in a stock form. If ou want heavy modifications, go for a standard largeport bluetop.

What kind of car do you want to put it in? AE86? Do you want to drift it? If so, go for a smallport redtop (the one from AE92 - will be enough for up to 190hp) or a largeport bluetop (better for super-high hp numbers - has larger intake and exhaust ports)

SidewaysGts · 11-16-2004, 11:25 AM

20vs a good candidate to be swapped into an 86. The cost to swap in the 20v stock i wouldnt say costs more then 1500 bucks, ut of course it really depends on who you know and what you can do yourself though so adjust accordingly.

Its a good engine for stock, but theres not a lot in terms of bolt on you can do to it. Cams for this engine run about 500 bucks a piece so theyre not exactly cheap to mod inside.

So are you deadset on the blacktop? potential wise the blacktop and silvertop are nearly the same. stock power wise the black top makes just a few ponies more, and your going to be paying a bit more for the black top because of it. Only differences are the silvertop runs Afm instead of map, and has slightly less compression. inside i believe the blacktop has lighter connection rods, which is why some prefer the silvertops (supposedly they can take more stress).

Darkstar · 11-16-2004, 01:03 PM

True. Blacktop is a better engine in a stock form, but when it comes to mods - silvertop is better. Blacktop has the whole crankshaft & stuff better balanced from the factory, what makes quite an advantage when comparing to learly 20v's.

SidewaysGts · 11-16-2004, 01:22 PM

I just say the silvertop is better for serious modding because youll be saving some bucks. Even in stock form the money youd save (unless u find a deal; thats differen im onyl talking on average) isnt realyl worth the extra hp you can cant on a hand.

ONtheROADagain · 11-17-2004, 01:58 PM

alex said he uses a 4agze block with a bluetop head? how much modification would this need to work? would it be easier than the 20v? why would he put the bluetop head on teh gze block?

Darkstar · 11-18-2004, 11:13 AM

The bluetop head utilises TVIS (Toyota Variable Intake System), which relies on secondary throttles, which are being opened at higher rpm for more air, what results in more power. The GZE block is the strongest one of the family, and the bluetop head is a great deal for HIGH powered 4AGE's.

11-15-2004, 07:02 PM	#1
ONtheROADagain Registered User Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 36	4age 20v or 4agze? pros and cons? hey guys. what are the pros and cons of both the 20 valve (blacktop) 4age, and the 4agze?

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11-16-2004, 08:58 AM	#2
Darkstar Post idiot Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Middle of nowhere Posts: 260	4AGZELU (whichever generation you like) Pros - Great "burn-the-tire-for-the-buck" factor (smile), great acceleration from a rolling start (isn't that great from standstill because of the tire slip), TORQUE!!, heavy duty internals - good base for turbocharging after taking the supercharger off. Cons - Computer stuff - if the wiring harness vibrates/shakes/whatever the ECU might get a wrong signal from a sensor on the intake manifold, occasionaly causing misfiring and knock, what may result in a Chernobyl style piston melt, supercharger malfunctions sometimes (definetely not as durable as a turbo), quite difficult to swap. Conclusion - Great engine if you take some loving care of it. 4AGELU 20 valve (blacktop) Pros - Great throttle response (especially in higher revs), VVTi (Variable Valve Timing with intelligence) allowing the engine to produce some nice high rpm horsepower numbers, AWESOME carbie-like sound effects. Cons - Even more difficult to swap than 4AGZE, doesn't have this torque, more sensitive for fuel octane changes, expensive and complex to modify. Conclusion - A perfect engine for autocrossing and fast road racing in a stock form. If ou want heavy modifications, go for a standard largeport bluetop. What kind of car do you want to put it in? AE86? Do you want to drift it? If so, go for a smallport redtop (the one from AE92 - will be enough for up to 190hp) or a largeport bluetop (better for super-high hp numbers - has larger intake and exhaust ports)

11-16-2004, 11:25 AM	#3
SidewaysGts Registered User Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 421	20vs a good candidate to be swapped into an 86. The cost to swap in the 20v stock i wouldnt say costs more then 1500 bucks, ut of course it really depends on who you know and what you can do yourself though so adjust accordingly. Its a good engine for stock, but theres not a lot in terms of bolt on you can do to it. Cams for this engine run about 500 bucks a piece so theyre not exactly cheap to mod inside. So are you deadset on the blacktop? potential wise the blacktop and silvertop are nearly the same. stock power wise the black top makes just a few ponies more, and your going to be paying a bit more for the black top because of it. Only differences are the silvertop runs Afm instead of map, and has slightly less compression. inside i believe the blacktop has lighter connection rods, which is why some prefer the silvertops (supposedly they can take more stress).

11-16-2004, 01:03 PM	#4
Darkstar Post idiot Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Middle of nowhere Posts: 260	True. Blacktop is a better engine in a stock form, but when it comes to mods - silvertop is better. Blacktop has the whole crankshaft & stuff better balanced from the factory, what makes quite an advantage when comparing to learly 20v's.

11-16-2004, 01:22 PM	#5
SidewaysGts Registered User Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 421	I just say the silvertop is better for serious modding because youll be saving some bucks. Even in stock form the money youd save (unless u find a deal; thats differen im onyl talking on average) isnt realyl worth the extra hp you can cant on a hand.

11-17-2004, 01:58 PM	#6
ONtheROADagain Registered User Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 36	alex said he uses a 4agze block with a bluetop head? how much modification would this need to work? would it be easier than the 20v? why would he put the bluetop head on teh gze block?

11-18-2004, 11:13 AM	#7
Darkstar Post idiot Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Middle of nowhere Posts: 260	The bluetop head utilises TVIS (Toyota Variable Intake System), which relies on secondary throttles, which are being opened at higher rpm for more air, what results in more power. The GZE block is the strongest one of the family, and the bluetop head is a great deal for HIGH powered 4AGE's.